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Post by Chris_Wendt on Jun 11, 2014 6:11:45 GMT -5
...I mean, parts of the California tenure laws have been declared unconstitutional. "A California judge ruled Tuesday that teacher tenure laws deprived students of their right to an education under the State Constitution and violated their civil rights. The decision hands teachers’ unions a major defeat in a landmark case, one that could radically alter how California teachers are hired and fired and prompt challenges to tenure laws in other states.
'Substantial evidence presented makes it clear to this court that the challenged statutes disproportionately affect poor and/or minority students,' Judge Rolf M. Treu of Los Angeles Superior Court wrote in the ruling. 'The evidence is compelling. Indeed, it shocks the conscience.'
The decision, which was enthusiastically endorsed by Education Secretary Arne Duncan, brings a close to the first chapter of the case, Vergara v. California, in which a group of student plaintiffs backed by a Silicon Valley millionaire argued that state tenure laws had deprived them of a decent education by leaving bad teachers in place." Read the report in The New York Times (link). Regards, Chris Wendt
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Post by rr on Jun 11, 2014 10:28:03 GMT -5
Was coming in here to post the same article!
It's about time and I think this is a step in the right direction to getting ineffective teachers removed. Still a very long way out but a decision like this, if it stands, is pretty big precedent.
The annoying part of the reporting on this is that the "...student plaintiffs backed by a Silicon Valley millionaire...", which of course will be picked apart and viewed by the "educational historian types" because it's big business sticking it's nose into education.
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Post by Chris_Wendt on Jun 11, 2014 11:03:40 GMT -5
...but the more meaningful piece is that it was a judge, a court, not a legislature or a governor seeking re-election, who handed down this decision. In deciding the appeal, if there is one, who filed the suit, who funded the filing of the suit will fade in comparison to the potential impact of the final outcome. While most watchers believe this will be appealed, no appeal has yet been filed. Potentially, Governor Jerry Brown could decide the judge was correct and that the decision should stand, without filing an appeal.
I am also guessing that other parties in other states are already researching the decision along with the case record, devising similar challenges. But I don't know if anyone will fund (and file) a similar suit before it is known whether this one is appealed or not, or even what the outcome will be, if it is appealed.
But in the final analysis, tenure is far from being a big problem here in Wantagh, or in most LI school districts. If someone came to me a said here is $10 Million to be used to challenge any one aspect of NY Education Law that I chose, tenure would not be my target. Triborough (The 1982 Triborough Amendment to the Taylor Law) would be the top contender.
Regards,
Chris Wendt
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Post by Chris_Wendt on Jun 11, 2014 11:55:55 GMT -5
Someone emailed this question to me: "How to we bring a suit to try and have it declared unconstitutional here in NY??" Reply: In order to prevail in a suit, you would need to have "standing", and, you would need to show that you have suffered damages from the unconstitutional operation of the allegedly unconstitutional law. In NY you would almost have to be either a student or group of students who could legitimately claim that they have not been provided a free, sound basic education as guaranteed by the NY Constitution, and that the reason for your not receiving the aforesaid free, sound, basic education was because of tenure. In Wantagh, probably no one could substantiate such a claim. Students in Hempstead, Roosevelt, some local districts or schools in The City could make such a claim, but successfully blaming tenure for the problem could be a stretch, given that there are other well documented problems starting with dysfunctional school boards, and so on down through incompetent administrators to cheating on tests and lying about grades. none of which was caused by tenure. Some group or subset of students in NYC could possible make out a claim based on tenure, especially where number of their teachers spent years in the Rubber Room. Perhaps some group of dissonant teachers could file a suit based on tenure, citing tenure as the cause of their being furloughed despite less competent, more senior teachers having been retained. While such a suit may have standing and merit, the likely result would simply be an end to the LIFO Policy (last in, first out layoff policy), restoration of a few junior teachers to their jobs with back pay, and a few more senior teachers then being furloughed instead, and the next time and the time after that.
The other thing you need to ask yourself is, if tenure in NY were declared unconstitutional, then with what system would it be replaced? Worse nepotism than we already have? The political spoils (patronage) system? Hmmmm? Chris Wendt chriswendt117@gmail.com
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Post by rr on Jun 11, 2014 12:45:34 GMT -5
You're right tenure isn't a big problem here in Wantagh UNLESS your child has an ineffective teacher that's been shuffled from grade to grade because they have tenure..then it is a big problem.
No problem is a big one until it hits you where it counts. I'd be careful generalizing things...and saying that tenure isn't a problem in Wantagh. That's like saying something like a rare form of cancer isn't a big issue. No, of course not, until you or someone you love has it.
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Post by Chris_Wendt on Jun 11, 2014 19:21:55 GMT -5
Let's avoid confusing the cause and the effect. I said tenure was not a BIG problem here in Wantagh, and that is true. Are there a few teachers working who should have retired or found different careers, yes. We are not perfect. My estimation of the number of ineffective teachers in Wantagh is between 5 and 12. Would ending tenure "fix" that? In other words, do you believe that ending teacher tenure would eliminate ineffective teachers AND prevent any teachers from being or becoming ineffective in the future, in Wantagh?
Tenure may pose a roadblock to swiftly eliminating ineffective teachers, but it certainly is not the root cause of their ineffectiveness. Fix Section 3020a of the Education Law and empower school districts to deal quickly and efficiently with ineffective teachers.
Instead of dumping tenure, how about if our department chairs and elementary principals started functioning like bosses instead of as buddies, requiring, of course, empowerment and expectations being set by the Superintendent and Assistant Superintendent for Instruction for them (as bosses) to correct or weed-out ineffective teachers under existing regulations, or risk being declared ineffective as department heads and building administrators?
And please don't forget my standing, non-rhetorical question...with what would you replace tenure? Political patronage? One very specific reason for having tenure was to prevent political patronage in public school employment.
Sincerely,
Chris Wendt
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Post by rr on Jun 11, 2014 20:48:32 GMT -5
Curious, what is your estimation based on?
Tenure should be replaced with a meritocracy, like most professions. Your pay and status is based on your performance…your performance is based several factors, test scores, evaluations, etc…
Let's not complicate this - it's not that hard and it works. It promotes competition, it promotes evolution and it motivates people to do better.
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Post by Chris_Wendt on Jun 12, 2014 6:51:56 GMT -5
Ineffective teachers do not exist in a vacuum. Persistently ineffective teachers are known to their peers and to their union, and to the parents of their students, ergo sequitur, to the PTA's, 6-12, SEPTA, etc. Ineffective teachers are known to their department heads and building principals as well as to the Assistant Superintendent for Instruction, and they eventually garner the attention of the Superintendent and the Board of Education. Ineffective teachers are not simply ignored, although they are not often removed. Sometimes, ineffective teachers can be remediated and their effectiveness improved or restored. Sometimes ineffective teachers come to understand the situation and leave voluntarily. To be fair to your question, my estimation is based on my experience on the BoE. Over the years, although I did not get to know every teacher, I did get to know many, and I believe that I got to know of a fairly high percentage of those who had become ineffective, through the 'squeaking wheel' principle. Thinking back, in a mental exercise I used to do, which teachers should be replaced in a given year, which teachers should be encouraged to retire this year, etc., at the high point I recall the number being eight; at the low point, in my recollection, the number was four. Wantagh does a good job in teacher recruitment and selection, and a very good job evaluating probationary teachers before awarding tenure. Not every new teacher in Wantagh earns tenure. Stories reaching my ears over the years, of bad teachers making it through probation and then showing their 'true colors' (as having bad attitudes, unacceptable behavior tendencies, etc.) shortly after being granted tenure numbered exactly two, and one of them did not survive the next year.
Thank you for proposing that... "Tenure should be replaced with a meritocracy, like most professions. Your pay and status is based on your performance…your performance is based several factors, test scores, evaluations, etc…
Let's not complicate this - it's not that hard and it works. It promotes competition, it promotes evolution and it motivates people to do better. " About 30% of my compensation is in the form of performance bonuses based on S.M.A.R.T. Goals. It is a highly motivating compensation-performance plan. But the structure wraps my personal performance into the performance of my unit into the performance of my location, into the performance of the company as a whole. But I am a manager, and a private sector management performance plan may not be appropriate to public school faculty members, other than department heads and building principals, as senior administrators. In order to go to your suggested meritocracy, many things would have to change in the landscape of public education. Many things must change in the landscape of public education, from governance to management to administration, to the overall structures of the industry. Many things will be changing in the landscape of public education, from governance to management to administration, to the overall structures of the industry, during the next 10-20 years. At what points on that continuum will New York State make the necessary changes...at what point along that continuum will Wantagh make the necessary changes, will be critical to the success or failure of the outcome. Technology, however, will continue to enable and entice parents to make more and greater choices for their own children, irrespective of where NY State and of where the Wantagh School District will find themselves along that continuum of needed change. I suspect that passionate parents will lead the movement toward change, and Wantagh UFSD and NY State will either follow their lead and adapt to change, or, risk becoming irrelevant in the future. We all have to raise the horizon of our thinking beyond next year! Regards, Chris Wendt
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Post by Chris_Wendt on Jun 13, 2014 6:43:46 GMT -5
Guest Contributor, Wantagh Alumnus ('67) Phil Wendt a retired scientist from The Sea Ranch, California: "In Ca, as in most states I assume, we have a well-developed civil service system that could easily serve the needs of the teachers and the administrators. The teachers unions claim that they need tenure to prevent indiscriminate discharge by administrators. The civil service system here allows for unions and while the firing process can be more cumbersome than industry, it does allow for termination through the civil service process. It does not allow for indiscriminate terminations.
In any event, whether it's a meritocracy, a civil service system, or a blend of the two, I see no reason why tenure protection should exist in this day and age.
The unions also claim that tenure is needed to attract employees to a profession plagued by low wages. I believe that it's the tenure system that holds the wages down, because it attracts low performers. Remove tenure protection and the market will work to bring wages up due to competition." (My brother is obviously not aware that nothing holds down the salaries of public school educators here, in NY. But his reflection on the instant tenure discussion is valid, and especially relevant, since it comes from source, so to speak, California. - CW)
Phil was a track star at Wantagh High and held the school record in the pole vault for a number of years, back when Mike Burns was the Coach. Regards, Chris Wendt
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Post by Chris_Wendt on Jun 19, 2014 12:32:10 GMT -5
Based on the evening TV news reports as recently as yesterday, it appears that tenure reform is gaining traction among parents in NY, especially NY City. My take on this: going after (attacking) "tenure" as a concept is not ripe for NY politics at any level, presently. Too bad the aggravated parents and sympathetic lawmakers do not understand that there is a relatively easy solution at hand, and it does not involve taking away tenure or changing eligibility for tenure. Although tenure appears to be the envelope protecting bad teachers, and bad behavior among some teachers, what actually is driving the insane cost and protracted legal process necessary to fire teachers and school administrators is NY Education Law §3020-a.
Here is the first, simplest, most immediate thing that needs to be done. Amend this: New York State Education Law Section 3020-a Disciplinary procedures and penalties. 2. (a) .... ....(b) The employee may be suspended pending a hearing on the charges and the final determination thereof. The suspension shall be with pay, except the employee may be suspended without pay if the employee has entered a guilty plea to or has been convicted of a felony crime concerning the criminal sale or possession of a controlled substance, a precursor of a controlled substance, or drug paraphernalia as defined in article two hundred twenty or two hundred twenty-one of the penal law; or a felony crime involving the physical or sexual abuse of a minor or student. ...to read thus: 2.(b) The employee may be suspended pending a hearing on the charges and the final determination thereof. The suspension shall be without pay, if the employee has been charged with a misdemeanor or felony crime. That won't solve all the problems preventing the termination of bad teachers behaving badly, but it will go a long way to remove truly badly behaving teachers in a very short time frame. Comments welcome. Chris Wendt chriswendt117@gmail.com
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